@fediverse @Perfide @MoogleMaestro
The staff of automatic have confirmed multiple times on Twitter and Mastodon that they're working on this for both Tumblr and wordpress. And many people offered their help, including the co-inventor of ActivityPub.

This IS happening. I don't know when, but it's coming.

@fediverse @PabloDiscobar @vaguerant
This is not how federation works. You only get the content from the people you follow. If you run a single user instance and you follow 5 people you only get the content from 5 people. If they're all in the same server it can even be grouped as a single request to the shared inbox.

Meta can have 100M, 1B, 5B users it change nothing for rest of us. Unless one of the local users really want to follow a million of accounts.

@matthieu_xyz @fediverse @vaguerant @PabloDiscobar
If I use mastodon. I don't need to signup or install anything. I can just get the content for free. They get minimal info about me (less metadata than in an email even!!) and I gave them no authorization to datamine anything! I'm also free from their terrible algorithm. It's like all good content in my inbox at no cost.

(And OP is right. Posting from mastodon is a pain in the ass)

@fediverse
@vaguerant
@PabloDiscobar
If I install Threads I need to signup. To signup I need to sign their ToS and give up all my rights. Then I need to install an app that will spy on my phone and send them a ton of info about me. And private info, not just the content of what I post. And they can resell and datamine that info because I gave them the right to do it.

@kbinMeta
@10A
Considering the issue about tankies on some lemmy instances, I think we understand how much left is too far left. And what you describe as "woke" isn’t it.

@fediverse
@rozno @SuperSpruce
Choosing a server is often the hardest step. That’s why you should send the signup page of your fav instance to your friends and not the official lemmy page.

@MicroWave
There is a huge bot issue right now (started 3 days ago). All the numbers are worthless.

It’s a known issue, all admins should add captcha to the subscription page, delete the bots and re-compute the actual number of users. Unless we do that, we won’t have a correct number.

We can still look at the Monthly Active Users. Bots don’t post (yet)

@Bilbo_Hobbit @Citronnier @gumchain
Les gens aiment citer gmail (~15% du réseau email) qui rend la vie un peu difficile aux boite auto-hébergés, mais on est encore loin du monopole et la disparition du mail. Et XMPP qui a quasi-disparu, mais pas forcément à cause de Google talk, mais aussi parce que le format est vieux, n’a pas évolué et que d’autres alternatives on plus la cote (matrix).

@Bilbo_Hobbit @Citronnier @gumchain
Ça, j’y crois beaucoup moins. De 1, je vois pas en quoi ça les intéresse de miner des données sur 1.4M d’utilisateurs quand ils ont 2Md sur insta et 300M potentiels utilisateurs sur Twitter.

Et de 2, le EEE ça marche souvent pas. Microsoft (qui a inventé le concept avant de complètement l’abandonner) l’a testé avec IE, Word et même Java et globalement c’est que des échecs.

@gumchain @Bilbo_Hobbit
Pour moi l’intérêt principal, c’est d’esquiver les loi anti-monopoles et de se préparer à l’EU Digital Markets Act qui impose "l’interopérabilité" aux géants du numérique. On parle surtout des chats instantannés, mais ça pourrait aussi concerner les réseaux sociaux.

L’autre intérêt c’est que les réseaux sociaux ont une date d’expiration. Facebook se fait ringardiser par insta qui se fait ringardiser par tiktok, donc c’est normal d’expérimenter de nouvelles choses

@thegiddystitcher @RedirectedPotato
Another con: You become an admin/moderator and have to keep up to date with the latest bad servers to defederate from and you’ll have to deal with all kind of bad posts yourself instead of relying on a moderation team.

@MicroWave
Yes, when your server is getting swarmed in spam, you first fediblock (or at least limit, when limit is supported like on mastodon).

Then you ask the admin of the instance what’s going on. You can also help them clean up the bots.

Then you can federate again once you’re 100% sure the bots are gone.

When the number of bots is high compared to the number of users, that’s even more reasons to block fast

@2014MU69 @MicroWave
Lemmy’s first big bot campaign, yay.

Bots only target successful platforms and mastodon has survived many bot campaigns, so I’m not too worried by this. But let’s give a hug to our admins. When all those accounts start spamming, they’ll need to do a lot of mitigation. Especially if the bots come from many different domains. (and also because lemmy moderation tools are not great)

@smallpatatas
I don’t understand why you need to "convince" anyone. If you want to block Meta you can just block Meta or join an instance that blocks Meta, there is no need to collectively defederate.

If your instance’s admin has enabled SECURE_FETCH and you block Meta’s domain (even as a simple user) you are effectively isolated from meta, even boosting your posts can’t expose them to Meta (thanks to SECURE_FETCH).

This can be a personal decision it doesn’t have to be collective.

@Trebach @slicedcheesegremlin
Yeah....

@slicedcheesegremlin
Mastodon users have the option to opt-out of search engines indexing by adding tags to their post hat are readable by web crawlers.

So you might not find everything from mastodon, but for a reddit-like it makes sense to be indexed.

@cedarmesa @c2h6
Diaspora is one of the oldest of the oldest. Much older than mastodon. They’re federated too, but not on the same network.

Mastodon and lemmy uses ActivityPub. (Mastodon used to run on OStatus, but then switched to ActivituPub later) Diaspora uses its own protocol and refuses to ever switch to a most recent one.

Some fediverse services however (friendica and hubzilla which are kinda facebook-like) are using multiple protocols and can federate with both mastodon and diaspora.

@Boingbong
Mastodon can do that. Lemmy not at the moment. But it’s a very needed features.

And hopefully not just users, but the transfer of an entire community should theoretically be possible. Like mods of !A@lemmy.A decided to migrate the community to !A@lemmy.B and all subscribers to the community are transferred. It is possible in principle

@Boingbong
Mastodon can do that. Lemmy not at the moment. But it’s a very needed features.

And hopefully not just users, but the transfer of an entire community should theoretically be possible. Like mods of !A@lemmy.A decided to migrate the community to !A@lemmy.B and all subscribers to the community are transferred. It is possible in principle

@programming
@WatTyler
There is a demo of an algorithmic timeline thingy for mastodon at https://fedifeed.herokuapp.com/ and I really really like how it has a bunch of sliders for fine-tuning. The time penalty in particular is very important.

Would be absolutely awesome to have the same on lemmy.

Edit: Lemmy doesn’t show my picture...

https://static.piaille.fr/media_attachments/files/110/542/349/085/964/483/original/23daedec7cd17277.png

@le_saucisson_masque
Lorsque tu postes sur lemmy, il y au moins trois dictateurs bienveillants qui peuvent te censurer.

L’admin de là où t’as créé ton compte.

Le modo de la communauté où tu as posté.

L’admin de là où se trouve ta communauté.

Je suppose que les admins de là où se trouve les lecteurs peuvent te masquer, mais ça changera pas grand chose pour 95% du reste du réseau ça n’affectera qu’un nombre réduit de lecteurs qui se trouve sur ce server en particulier.

@ValueSubtracted
Instance users are only local users.
Community users include remote users who remotely subscribed to the community.

So the community users will always be higher than the number of instance users.

And it still doesn’t count lurkers like we who reply to a thread without subscribing.

@SuperIce @domage
Misskey is a Japanese twitter-like. It’s actually older than mastodon and very popular in Japan specifically. They have custom emoji reactions under posts, they have animation and advanced markdown, they can have cat ears on their profile pictures, THEY HAVE QUOTE REPOST, chat, advanced search features, etc.

Misskey have been forked multiple times (foudkey, calckey, etc.) and those forks are more popular in English-speaking communities.

@_finger_
We can have both generic instances and instances around a particular topic.

We already have a few lemmy dedicated to a particular community like latte.isnot.coffee and startrek.website

@OtakuAltair
You are under the yoke of at least three benevolent dictators.

Your home instance admin can deactivate your account for whatever reason (read the rules.)

The mod teams from the community you post into can ban you from the community for whatever reason (read the rules)

The admin that is hosting the community can remotely block you for whatever reason (read the rules)

I cannot answer the question about cats and dogs because I don’t make the rules.

@jherazob What do you mean?
Pixel fed has a home, local and global timeline as well as an explore page and hashtags following.

All three home, local and global are reverse-chronological with respectively the people/hashtags you follow, the posts from your instances and the posts from all indexed users from other instances. The explore page is to see algorithmic-ally trending posts from local and distant instances.

You can even remotely explore local feeds from a selection of instances

@V4uban
Donc plutôt que de se lancer nous même au risque de voir des instances disparaître avec toutes les communautés qu’ils hébergent, il faudrait peut-être demander à des admins d’instances mastodon si ils veulent bien gérer une instance lemmy* en parallèle, comme lemmy.world est un service frère de mastodon.world ou blahaj.zone avec lemmy.blahaj.zone.

*: lemmy ou kbin. Kbin est vraiment prometeur.

@LaQuadrature @admin @admin@mastouille.fr @thomas_virtubox
Quelqu’un veut se lancer?

@V4uban J’apprécie énormément l’effort des nouveaux arrivants pour créer rapidement de nouvelle instances. (comme sh.itjust.works). Mais on ne sait pas trop si ça va durer dans le temps.

C’est cool de répartir les utilisateurs sur pleins de petits serveurs, mais pour héberger les communautés, il vaudrait mieux des instances de taille moyenne hébergés par des admins expérimentés.

@chocolatine
Ça dépend de ce que l’on attend de lemmy. Si l’objectif c’est de dépasser Reddit en nombre d’utilisateurs/post par minute ou n’importe quelle autre métrique. Non j’y crois pas du tout

Si l’objectif c’est de passer un cap critique qui permet au réseau d’être utilisable et utile. Alors oui c’est tout à fait possible. Mastodon l’a fait et c’est plus dur de réseauter un twitter-like qu’un reddit-like. Même une commu reddit de 10 personnes peut être cool, twitter est censé être mondial

@Senseibull
You can think of it like emails.

A lemmy community is like an automated mailbox that sends everything they receive to all subscribers.

You can host a mailing list/community on gmail.

Then you can subscribe to the mailing list from outlook.

Then a user can send a post to the mailing list from yahoo.

The automated mailbox at gmail will receive the message from yahoo and send it to outlook and all other subscribers.

@aka_quant_noir @Bicyclejohn

Some people are working on that. Calckey will soon be able to import posts from twitter (can alerady import from mastodon). Pixelfed can already import from instagram right now!!

Kbin and lemmy are very late in that regard. You can’t even migrate your social graph.

@Bicyclejohn I don’t know about "replace", but popular social media could JOIN the fediverse.

I don’t blame new users to be late on news. But to make a quick recap, the people interested in implementing ActivityPub include:

- Meta (insta/twt replacement)
- Tumblr
- Wordpress.com
- Medium (currently only running mastodon)
- Discourse
- Flarum

Last time I check those were a few popular social media.

Discourse and Flarum in particular are relevant to Lemmy

@Kaldo @mstrbtr @fomo_erotic

Kbin has a "microblog" tab, you can see posts from mastodon people there. They’re either associated to a magazibe thanks to hashtags or in "random". And you can follow people.

On lemmy, you can’t follow people and any post that isn’t associated to a community is just invisible to you.

@aianarchist @CannotSleep420
There need to be one first follower for the community to be synced.

You are the first to follow this community from this lemmy server. Now the community is synced and will keep updating.

@fomo_erotic @mstrbtr
Lemmy and kbin are two softwares who speak the same language. You can see kbin posts on lemmy and lemmy posts on kbin. Communities from lemmy are called magazines on kbin.

The features and UI are different. Kbin is more integrated to Twitter-like softwares like mastodon.

@PriorProject

I think that’s almost inevitable. Almost all mid-sized lemmy instances will have a copy of almost all mid-sized lemmy communities.

Lemmy is a very different beast compared to mastodon. Of course not everyone is following everyone on mastodon, but if you have an even slightly diverse userbase, they’ll subscribe to a lot of different communities and your instance will have a lot of traffic very quickly. Hosting lemmy is going to be challenging.

@bruhsoulz asklemmy is like a mailing list or a twitter bot that retweets everything it receives. If it can’t receive messages, it can’t retweet/boost/forward them to others.

@bruhsoulz
If you want an example of what happens when two servers block one another.

calckey.social and lemmy.one can talk to each other. So my post is visible here: https://lemmy.one/comment/33034
calckey.social can’t talk with lemmy.ml so the post isn’t on lemmy.ml
Since lemmy.ml is the home server of "asklemmy", it can’t be forwarded to other servers so no one can see it except lemmy.one and calckey.social

@xboxLIVE @bruhsoulz

That’s a lot of message duplication and it will have some growing pains for the lemmy admins, but at least exploration shouldn’t be too hard.

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